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Old 13-03-11, 13:51
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T4 Post Icon 2.4D AAB Injection Timing

Hello everyone

Had a few issues with the Van , it wouldn't Idle so increased idled speed and wouldn't start so narrowed it down to the Injection timing being out.

The Belts were all change 20k miles ago and been told after this time the Injection timing may need resetting , i've been after a Diesel Pulse Adaptor to check how far its out but can't get hold of one. Also need to borrow a DTI Gauge.

So in the mean time removed the belt covers to check the timing marks.


The Crank at TDC



Injection pump pulley mark is at the rear ? i thought it should be 180deg round at the front ????



Timing mark at the rear as detailed by plastic pipe , VW manual says it should be at the front.



All the pulley's



Hopefully i will get hold of a DTI Gauge but may have to buy a Pulse Adaptor to get the timing perfect.

Last edited by Brookster; 15-03-11 at 13:29. Reason: better title
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Old 13-03-11, 15:10
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Default Re: AAB Injection Timing

Spun the Crank another 360 deg and it is now at the front, i'll pull the rocker off and check the cams are TDC
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Old 13-03-11, 18:49
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Default Re: AAB Injection Timing

Mate .... I did mine last year and if I remember correctly.......... The crank has a mark on the lower plastic cover, the "V" in the pump pully should line up with a mark on the casting on the block, the fly wheel is marked with a line which lines up with a notch on the casting behind the fly wheel and .......... again IIRC the exhaust & inlet cam loabs on cyl no1 should both be pointing in the air equaly on both sides ........... Pleaase take what I just said with an element of caution as I'm using memory ! .... but I think Im right. I did have to get the pump set up by the local diesel guy for 30....

.................. hope that helps
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Old 13-03-11, 19:05
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Default Re: AAB Injection Timing

There is a pin available for the pump sprocket that goes through the sprocket and into the pump bracket.
Pulse adapter and strobe timing light is the best and most accurate way of checking and setting the timing on the 2.4D,dial gauge will get you somewhere near but not spot on,with dial gauge you can only check and set the static timing.

If you do manage to buy a pulse adapter set the timing at 12 degrees BTDC at idle

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Old 13-03-11, 19:34
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Default Re: AAB Injection Timing

Quote:
Originally Posted by aggie View Post
If you do manage to buy a pulse adapter set the timing at 12 degrees BTDC at idle

Yes pulse adaptor is the best bit of kit , i have a Timing light with Advance and Retard for tuning the Golf .


From what i've research 12 Advance is standard but 14 deg will give better performance and MPG probably especially with me running SVO

so Pulse Adpator it is then for the timing light
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Old 13-03-11, 19:43
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Default Re: AAB Injection Timing

If you set it to 14 degree BTDC then when you pull out the cold start it will pull the timing to 18 degree BTDC and it will probably smoke and missfire.
Give it a try and post your findings here,there is not much info on 2.4D timing

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Old 13-03-11, 19:44
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Default Re: AAB Injection Timing

Just Purchased a Gunson Diesel Pulse Adaptor more my Gunson Timing Light


105 but needed and i will use it on other T4's too


http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=STRK:MEWAX:IT
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Old 13-03-11, 19:47
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Default Re: AAB Injection Timing

Quote:
Originally Posted by aggie View Post
If you set it to 14 degree BTDC then when you pull out the cold start it will pull the timing to 18 degree BTDC and it will probably smoke and missfire.
Give it a try and post your findings here,there is not much info on 2.4D timing
i'll keep you posted, will get it to 12 deg first then alter it once i'm 100% certain its running correctly.
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Old 15-03-11, 13:20
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Default Re: AAB Injection Timing

Diesel Pulse Adpator arrived today , so i will assess the existing timing of the Injection setting which i presume will be about
4DEG BTDC (Not 12 deg BTDC)

Here's an interesting thread from Brickwerx regarding 2.4D Tuning.


http://www.brick-yard.co.uk/forum/to...opic26994.html

Quote Thread -

Now, until now, this was speculation but until today I have been unable to check it.
2.4D's are slow, we all know that.
You can set them up like Mr VW says, or like Mr Autodata says and they never seem "right"
I've done loads of these cambelts and never really had any trouble, it's one of those things, it's booked in, you change the cambelts, set the pump timing up afterwards and off it goes, they always seem slow, but they get set to what the book says, so that must be right, well, seemingly not.
i've long had the suspicion that all it not well with the 2.4D injection pump and today I managed to prove it.
Story, I'll start from the beginning.

I have recently had a reasonably high mileage T4 Westy High top in for a belt change, belt was done, van ran like a bag of .
Timing was checked, and found to be a mile out, so timing was reset in the time honoured fashion with a dial gauge in the end of the pump.
van now runs loads better, goes up hills, but blue smokes from cold and even when warm it's a bit lumpy and a blue haze from exhaust.
Engine will not start from cold without the coldstart lever (telling me the pump timing is retarded)
So, timing is bob on according to VW, bob on to Autodata but runs okay but not as well as it could.
This moring I took delivery of a "Diesel pulse adapter" it's a small box containing a 9v battery, it has a small piezo electric clamp that goes around an injector line, an eart lead and a loop of wire.
What the box does is sense the pulses in the injector pipe and converts it into a signal that any petrol timing light can use as a trigger for the strobe.
So, this afternoon i managed to test out my worn pump but timed up right theory for real.

Pump timing according to Autodata is .55mm lift@TDC.I set the pump a little advanced at .60mm lift at TDC.According to Autodata, to set pump timing dynamically (with pulse adapter) then the timing should be between 12 degrees BTDC and 16 degrees BTDC depending on the equipment used.So, piezo electric thingy is a bit finiky, and it didn't work at first so the injector line was cleaned with a scotch pad, not pulse adapter springs into life!
I have a Snap On timing light with digital advance and retard.
I set it to the 12 degrees and the timing marks where nowhere to be seen!
I kept dropping back until I could see the marks, which I occasionally saw at 0 degrees BTDC telling me although according to the dial gauge I though the timing was advanced the timing was over 12 degrees retarded! That explains the poor starting and blue smoke then!
After a bit of faffing around I managed to get the timing with the pulse adapter set to about 12 degrees BTDC and all seemed well, started better, reduced smoke and according to test pilot power was as it was pre belt.

So, moral of story, when setting injection pump timing with a dial, be careful, although the dial is telling you what you want to know all may not be as it seems.
I can only presume that this effect is caused by a worn pumping element, taking longer for the pumping element to reach such a pressure that it will open the nozzles, the more wear, the lower the pressure the more the timing will become retarded.
Other things that could effect this are injector nozzle opening pressures set too high.

Last edited by Brookster; 15-03-11 at 13:27.
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Old 15-03-11, 19:20
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Default Re: AAB Injection Timing

Recieved the Diesel Pulse Adaptor

Connected it all up and the LED is flashing, connected the Timing light to the Pick up loop but nothing

Connected the Timing light to my other petrol cars and its working fine

any ideas anybody ? could the pick up loop be faulty

cheers
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