[Mekong Campers]

Hi

I'm trying to find out what is needed re a gas locker for a gas safe cert. Gas safe have referred me to British standard EN 1949:2011 but it costs £150 to download a copy!!

Does aynone have access to the BS or have information about what is required for a gas locker according to the standard.

Cheers!

 

[spirals]

The Standard document is 42 pages long and has diagrams, so it's difficult to sumarise all of it, but PM sent

 

[Jolly_ollie]

I am just about to build my own locker, not certain of the standards but as far as I have gleaned:
Needs to be fireproof for half an hour, be sealed, have a fixed gas pipe brocket, a tank strap, drop out vent and be accessible only from the outside. I am planing to make it from 3/4 ply, rubber seal round door, lined with a fire blanket and fitted behind the bed so that it can only be opened with the tailgate up. This seems sensible enough to me and it should be enough for the H&S nutters.

There are too many regulations. £150....they are having a larf!

 

[gismo]

Hi I have the standards and yes it does cost a lot,you will also be surprised at some of the regs
jolly ollie has got some of it right, but You can have internal access. It does not state anywhere that it has to be fire proof There are strict controls as where the drop out vent is placed , if you do not hire out the van and it is only for personal use it does not require a tightness test?? . It does not state what materials the locker is made of and you do not have to line it with steel . It came into effect
in March 2011 but it also states that all conflicting national standards shall be withdrawn at the latest August 2011. there is much more some if you pm me I will try and help you out

Thanks

 

[warehouse_will]

I have just been on the phone with a van concersion company (about my own van!) the guy said that I would have to have a pop top in order to get a gas safety cert, is this right?

 

[gismo]

I have just been on the phone with a van concersion company (about my own van!) the guy said that I would have to have a pop top in order to get a gas safety cert, is this right?

That's a new one ???? phone him back and ask why should be Interesting

 

[warehouse_will]

That's a new one ???? phone him back and ask why should be Interesting

The guy said it was because on the gas safe test, you need to run the gas at full for 10 mins with all windows and dors shut. He said it would kill you after 3 mins hence failing the test (infact the more I think about this the more stupid it sounds!!) If you have a pop top it will allow the fumes to circulate.

Any ideas?

 

[sturmey]

I can half understand his thinking, running both burners for 10 mins with all windows and door closed will fill the van with carbon monoxide which has no way venting outside. The pop top has a mesh vent in it to allow ventilation, where has theory falls down is carbon monoxide is heavier then air so the van will fill up from botton to top so in theory won't make much difference. I would like to find out how long it takes for a van with the burners lit to reach a dangerous level of corbon monoxide as it was something that crossed my mind a while back and made me consider a Webasto hob.

 

[sturmey]

A quick recap and the reason for the poptop is to allow ventilation this allows for the oxygen being burnt by the hob to be replaced meaning the hob burns properly (blue flame) a not produce carbon monoxide. The test in question maybe for a house (10 mins on full)and is the engineers interpretation of the test for a camper.

 

[Jolly_ollie]

Well this is fascinating, the way false info gets circulated. I had been convinced by an expert that the box needed to have 30 mins fireproofing (hence the usual metal boxes) and I was also told that access could only be from the outside. Is this just interpretation of the regs and is there a difference between caravans, and the various classes of motorhome? What is the specific reg re the drop out vent? It would be useful to know before I drill the hole!

 

[ed-j]

Just throwing a cat amongst the pidgeons, but I had a similar discussion with a very experienced motorhome and caravan service engineer last week.
I have always been of the opinion that the requirements were often interpreted quite losely and that many of those qualified to test them, dont fully understand them.
My understanding is that a motorcaravan or caravan MUST have a particular volume of both upper and lower fixed ventilation (ie opening a window doesnt count).
I suggested that a VW or similar without additional vents should not meet the requirements......he agreed and said he would not issue a certificate in such circumstances. Apparantly a pop top (due to the breathability of the canvas) does meet the requirements.....However, I cant see how this differs from opening a window, as it is entirely possible to cook with the roof down.
I dont quite know what the 10min thing is about.
Interestingly I did see a pop top T5 for sale at a dealers in cardiff a few weeks ago, and on the pop top they had 3 additional mushroom vents.....it looked awful.

 

[Grumpy 1]

Hi not sure on regs but have made mine from Gas locker from a caravan drop vent in the bottom etc if its good enough for avon*ale its good for me T: Oh I also have a gas detector for good measure

 

[spirals]

What is the specific reg re the drop out vent? It would be useful to know before I drill the hole!

This is what it says (and I'm quoting, I'm not an expert. My bottle is lashed to the inside wall of the van at present...):
5.6 Cylinder compartments with internal access and low capacity cylinders
The fixed ventilation for cylinder compartments complying with 5.2 may be provided via one vent provided the
following conditions are complied with:
a) the compartment can contain a maximum of two cylinders with a maximum combined capacity of 7 kg;
b) the vent shall have a minimum internal diameter of 20 mm;
c) where a duct is attached to the ventilation opening the maximum length of the duct shall not exceed
5 times the internal diameter of the duct. It may be extended to ten times the internal diameter of the duct,
if it is necessary, to avoid interference with under floor flue outlets;
d) the duct shall be positioned at low level in the floor and be resistant to LPG;
e) the duct shall fall throughout its entire length to the outside of the vehicle.

5.2 that it refers to (which answers your question about internal access, because presumably a Transporter is type approved?):
5.2 Cylinder compartments with internal access
For motor caravans and other vehicles where penetration of a type approved base vehicle bodywork would be
required to provide external access, internal access to the compartment is permitted provided the following
conditions are met:
a) the compartment can contain a maximum of two cylinders, each having a capacity of not more than
16 kg;
b) access between the compartment and the habitable area is only provided via an attached sealed door or
hatch, the bottom edge of which is not less than 50 mm above the compartment floor.

Re insulation, the only mention I can find is a requirement re positioning of the box and the exhaust. The box must be >250mm away from the exhaust horizontally/diagonally and >300mm vertically when viewed from above. It can be closer than this (which I think it would be if it's in the typical wardrobe position?) but (EDIT) you need to have some sort of heat shield that gives a minimum of 25mm of air circulation between the exhaust and the box underside. It doesn't seem to stipulate what this insulation should be but presumably the shielding that is presently under the van suffices? (end EDIT)

 

[mrshells]

Also not a lot of people know you only need a gas safety certificate if you are renting it out
if its your own van for your own use you dont need one
A lot of insurers require it but Adrian Flux dont want one T:

 

[WickedVanz]

Also not a lot of people know you only need a gas safety certificate if you are renting it out
if its your own van for your own use you dont need one
A lot of insurers require it but Adrian Flux dont want one T:

I think piece of mind is worth the inspection......T:

 

[Jolly_ollie]

Thanks for the info Mr.Spirals. I think I'll proceed with plan A and hope for a gas safety certificate. I'd like to get the whole system checked so I'll be happy going to sleep knowing we will all wake up and are unlikely to explode. . The insurance business is of less importance, though with the appropriate certificates you can get much cheaper insurance through the caravan club.

 

[Uberbus]

Not wishing to blatantly flog my wares but I have just taken a new batch of metal gas lockers in that I use on my conversions should you need one http://uberbus.co.uk/parts-shop/product/view/1/1

 

[dazteen]

Any one tell me what a drop out vent is please

 

[Uberbus]

It's a vented hole in the floor to allow the gas to fall out should there be a leak

 

[blackvanman!]

Not wishing to blatantly flog my wares but I have just taken a new batch of metal gas lockers in that I use on my conversions should you need one http://uberbus.co.uk/parts-shop/product/view/1/1

Whereabouts do you normally fit the box clough?