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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hello All,



I have owned my van for 13 years and love it to bits! Now the engine is in bits and I’m in bits! I am slowly getting over the fact that the timing belt has snapped and trying to see it as an opportunity to give the engine an overhaul so that it lasts another 13 years +! I have so far been using the Haynes manual and have made it my bed time reading as this is a huge/steep learning curve for me!

Last weekend I removed the camshaft cover and have established that the camshaft is shattered in two places and my head is broken too, not to mention my bank balance! This weekend I have begun the stripping down of the engine in order to take the cylinder head off. I need to see the pistons in order to find out if they are cracked or not before deciding if a whole new engine is needed. Dropping the engine out of the van is a whole new challenge for me and I can't really afford for someone to do it all. So first of all I needed to find out the extent of the damage. I understand that the valve stems are 8mm in diameter and strong! After speaking with AW Engineering Darwen Ltd it is likely that the valves have cracked the top of the cylinders but unlikely that the cranks would be have damaged the main bearings etc. Also unlikely that the turbocharger has any debris in it as quite a quick and clean break in the camshaft.

My question is how do I remove the inlet manifold as the bolts look impossible to reach with the engine mounted in the vehicle? I have read how to do it in the Haynes manual but it does not say if you need to gain access from underneath the vehicle or somehow get to the back of the engine from the front? I have separated the front of the exhaust (two bolts) and I have a tool to prise open the exhaust spring clips if needed. The info I have says that the exhaust and the inlet manifold both need removing. I guess the block would be mighty heavy with too many appendages! It seems tricky to disconnect the turbo as well as it has four bolts on the top of its mounting bracket then another underneath.




I will try to attach some photos showing my progress, but it is hard getting under the van and seeing things clearly without a proper ramp and is so uncomfortable out on the street/pavement! I could do with some drawings of the assembled engine or a 3d model or something with labelled parts like an exploded diagram. As always any help appreciated and I expect others will be in the same boat at some point since even the youngest t4’s are 17 years old!

Pic of Cracked Camshaft!

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Radiator removed and oil and coolant all drained out
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Intresingly, the injection pump timing belt sprocket bolt was loose and coming off after the cambelt snapped. I undid it with my fingers!

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Note the rust on the aftermarket injectors! The original ones never rusted that much, these are only about 5 years old. Maybe something to consider on the newer generation of injectors!

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Here is a shot of the turbocharger looking from the front of the bonnet. I don't see how to under the four bolts holding it on. under front underneath the vehicle?
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Here is the exhaust manifold looking from the front with bonnet up. I cant see how to undo all of the fixing bolts.

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Here is a shot of the fuel injector pump. How to remove? It looks like there are three 13mm hex head bolts holding it in place but they are really stiff but cant see a not on other side.

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Here is the exhaust right angled bracket it connects to the exhaust front pipe which has two spring clips on it. Can this just all be pushed to one side to allow the cylinder head to come out?

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Brake vacuum pump taken off, its spring was under load as the cam lobe as placing pressure on it! Woops, still got it off though but messy work. Trying to keep all the parts clean in bags or Chinese take away containers all labelled up.

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glow plugs are out using a 10mm long reach socket

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I have many more photos as doing this is probably the only way I can remember what order things were taken off and what order they go back on again!
 

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Discussion Starter #2
Here is the inlet manifold and where the torch is shining shows the allen key bolts but I don't see how to get to them.
176673
 

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I’m sorry to read that your timing belt has gone, worse nightmare I can imagine. I can’t offer too much help as I’ve not removed a head before, but I have been thinking about changing mine due to a rattle I’ve inherited from a valve lifter change..trying to cure one problem and creating another.

I think the manifolds are a pain to remove but it is do able with a good selection of ratchets, sockets and wobbly bits. I think someone on here has recently done a job involving manifold removal so that’s worth taking a look at.
The pump you removed is the brake vacuum pump.

You’ll also require a decent spline bit to remove the head bolts. I read somewhere that someone rounded the heads off because they thought the bolts were a torx head so just beware of that one.

Also, the TDI is very tricky to set up timing wise and requires some special tools and also Vag com to read the timing when it’s finally up and running.

Hope some of this is of some use to you and good luck with it.
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
I’m sorry to read that your timing belt has gone, worse nightmare I can imagine. I can’t offer too much help as I’ve not removed a head before, but I have been thinking about changing mine due to a rattle I’ve inherited from a valve lifter change..trying to cure one problem and creating another.

I think the manifolds are a pain to remove but it is do able with a good selection of ratchets, sockets and wobbly bits. I think someone on here has recently done a job involving manifold removal so that’s worth taking a look at.
The pump you removed is the brake vacuum pump.

You’ll also require a decent spline bit to remove the head bolts. I read somewhere that someone rounded the heads off because they thought the bolts were a torx head so just beware of that one.

Also, the TDI is very tricky to set up timing wise and requires some special tools and also Vag com to read the timing when it’s finally up and running.

Hope some of this is of some use to you and good luck with it.
Hiya,

Thanks for your reply. I have this set I believe its 12mm for the cylinder head bolts. So you reckon there is a way to take all of the exhaust manifold and turbo from the front? Not underneath the van? I have three socket sets so should have all the bits n pieces. Even an 'snake camera' to get in places and have a look! I think I read about your post and trying to solve the tapping noise. I have a company who specialises in diesel timing etc. I just need to be able to drive the van and get all the engine back in phase sufficiently in order to get it to the garage for the final VAG bit etc. Currently the crankshaft, camshaft, injection pump are all completely out of phase following the snap of the cambelt!

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Here is the tightening/loosening sequence for the cylinder head bolts according to the Haynes manual. Seems logical enough to me to prevent head warp!
176854
 

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Yes, those are the correct Spline bits. I recently bought a set of impact ones from Machine Mart just in case I need to remove my head..

You may need to reach some manifold bolts from underneath but as I said my knowledge is limited at the moment as I’ve not removed any Manifolds from mine as yet. I may only change the cam and lifters yet. I believe you can get to all the bolts one way or another.

You’ll need a tool to hold the crankshaft pulley also to get that undone. I recently got a Sealey kit with one in along with some tools for setting the timing.

I also have a Haynes manual but I wouldn’t trust it 100%.
 

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Chances that whichever piston(s) hit the valves will need replacing.
I bought a "cheap" 'velle that had suffered a belt fail....THREE pistons were totally wrecked, and the head beyond repair also.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.....but a recon engine may be the cheapest/easiest option.

The reason why the belt should be replaced every 50,000 or 5 years!
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Chances that whichever piston(s) hit the valves will need replacing.
I bought a "cheap" 'velle that had suffered a belt fail....THREE pistons were totally wrecked, and the head beyond repair also.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.....but a recon engine may be the cheapest/easiest option.

The reason why the belt should be replaced every 50,000 or 5 years!

Yes after talking with Keith at the AW engineering (as recommended by Hobbyhorse on here) company he believes one or more of the pistons may have been impacted by the valves. But until I do a visual check it seems pointless to spend £1000 + on an engine or 2000 for a reconditioned one. Also It will be easier to get an engine out if many of the parts have been stripped off it as smaller/lighter. My timing belt was inspected and re adjusted just 3000 miles ago and 2.5 years. However the van was sat around a lot as its a camper and the belt went an orange rust colour so went rotten basically. Winters kill my van out on the street! Just did all the rust repairs and bodywork last summer! See photo.
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Yes, That's well and truly snapped. Shocking after 2 1/2 years too. I wonder if a failed component has caused that to snap like that ? The mechanic who does my MOT said it's usually a component that's failed, Water pump or tensioner more so than a rotten belt.

I'd be the same though, I'd want to know what other damage is done before buying a new engine.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Yes, That's well and truly snapped. Shocking after 2 1/2 years too. I wonder if a failed component has caused that to snap like that ? The mechanic who does my MOT said it's usually a component that's failed, Water pump or tensioner more so than a rotten belt.

I'd be the same though, I'd want to know what other damage is done before buying a new engine.
From what I have found out in order to replace a pistons I would need to remove the sump and undo the con rods and it would be a complete nightmare without removing the engine! On the plus side I can buy just the pistons even just one on its own and the rings from the engineering company I mentioned. I was turning the fuel injector pump and it was very stiff but maybe that is a good sign as pressurising the diesel.. Perhaps something has gone as you said, but when warming the van engine up in order to give it a little drive around the block I did notice a ticking noise and should have realised that it was a damaged timing belt about to snap. Still hindsight is a wonderful teacher!
 

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I don't think it's worth the hassle of replacing one Piston. If they are damaged, may as well get the whole thing re built. Something else is bound to go wrong then you're back to square one.

I think you'll get good advice from AW engineering. I have spoken to Keith myself and he seems to know his stuff. HobbyHorse on here recommended him to me.

Ticking noise ? That's all I seem to hear on my Van these days :)
 

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Looks like you're already a good way into it.

Okay, leave the glowies in (EDIT, they're out!), remove their loom, remove any wires, ducts, clips, pipes (there's a small water piper to the back of the head). Undo the 2 clips that hold the exhaust downpipe to the turbo tail (can be an pain), remove and plug turbo oil pipes, remove the head spline bolts in the reverse sequence to tightening (avoids head warp), remove the hidden bolt attaching the head to the alternator bracket... then... gurd your loins & lift the whole head / manifolds / turbo out in one lump ?

HH
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
Looks like you're already a good way into it.

Okay, leave the glowies in (EDIT, they're out!), remove their loom, remove any wires, ducts, clips, pipes (there's a small water piper to the back of the head). Undo the 2 clips that hold the exhaust downpipe to the turbo tail (can be an pain), remove and plug turbo oil pipes, remove the head spline bolts in the reverse sequence to tightening (avoids head warp), remove the hidden bolt attaching the head to the alternator bracket... then... gurd your loins & lift the whole head / manifolds / turbo out in one lump ?

HH
Thanks for this write up. In the Haynes guide it says to remove the glow plugs as I guess if you broke one off we would be in a World if pain! Also i thought when setting the engine to TDC it would make it easier to turn by hand since no compression. Anyway im just following the guide as all i have plus a bit if experience with rebuilding motorcycle engines.

I spotted the oil feed for the turbo charger and thought that's next on the list snd somewhere there is a oil return but not spotted it yet.

I am unsure if i need to remove all of the pulleys and sprockets since belt already snapped such as crankshaft pulley (or is it a sprocket!).

I'm going to replace the clutch as well but obviously depending on outcome of pistons etc.

Cali campers say they have a acv engine for £950 but i would have to hire a van and equipment in order to collect. Then store it, pay deposit until mine has been delivered to him. So gets complicated especially when working full time. Also a second hand engine would need rebuilding fir longevity.


Thanks for the help hobby horse and everyone thus far.
 

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I spotted the oil feed for the tirbi charger and thought that's next on the list snd somewhere there is a oil return but not spotted it yet.
The turbo oil return is on the underside of the turbo core, a small pipe that runs down to the oil gallery bracket above the oil filter.

I am unsure if i need to remove sll of the pulleys and sprockets since belt already snapped such as crankshaft pulley (or is it a sprocket!).
Remove both camshaft pulleys (the timing end is quite near the suspension turret, use a quality counterhold tool i.e. Sealey); also remove all the timing covers.

Cali campers say they have a acv engine for £950
Nah....?
Although they run for a long time, these engines all have substantial wear @ 200k. Send the short engine off to Keith @ AW** & buy a new head if required, he'll arrange the shipping both ways. You'll also need a full gasket set & head bolts (only use Elring or Victor Reinz); some of these engines do not have a sump gasket - dont add one, use 'Dirko' red sealant.

A realistic price for all this work including belts / sundries / teething problems is around £1500 - £1800** with you on the spanners.

**Approx price assuming new head, rebore & new piston set.

HH
 

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Discussion Starter #16

Been watching this guy on Youtube. He is doing in my opinion a great job on giving this ACV 2.5 TDI engine an overhaul. The engine is looking like new! Although he has not had to replace or touch the pistons, rings, bores etc. I'm interested to see if an completely assembled engine (maybe less exhaust/inlet manifold) can fit back into his van. I can't even see the engine mountings yet and I have striped loads of components out.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Chances that whichever piston(s) hit the valves will need replacing.
I bought a "cheap" 'velle that had suffered a belt fail....THREE pistons were totally wrecked, and the head beyond repair also.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.....but a recon engine may be the cheapest/easiest option.

The reason why the belt should be replaced every 50,000 or 5 years!
£360 is the cost for a reconditioned head which includes camshaft, new hydraulic valves x 10, camshaft seals, new valves. Then £80 for the splined m12 bolts x 10 and head hasket from AW Engineering company on an exchange basis. So I will definitely and gladly go for that if this is all I need. But you are no doubt correct and I will need the pistons and a rebore as well. Did you repair your cheap Velle in the end? My van was valued by the insurance company at £12000 as its a pop top etc. Now its probably worth £2k!
 

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Orange rust on your belt is indicative of fretting failure of a tensioner or idler bearing, vibrating itself to bits. It hasn't got long if you can see that rusty powder. Of course you wouldn't have known it was happening since the belt is covered by a lovely black cover...

On refitting the crank pulley - It's vitally important to use the super thin diamond coated washer that's supplied with the kits, and angle tighten the NEW bolt correctly. There was no way I could do that myself with a 3/4 breaker bar, so I bought a torque multiplier off a popular auction site, about £50, and a (24 or 27mm, can't remember!) 3/4 socket. This fits perfectly with the crank pulley holder tool and doesn't need any bars at all. My multiplier was 58:1 so 29 complete turns with the handle and it was at its 180 degrees, dead easy.

This is the number one cause of belt failure on these engines, folks gunning up and/or reusing the bolt and thinking it'll do and in a lot of other cars it is. If you look very closely at how this all fits together you will see that the crank sprocket is only properly attached to the crankshaft via the pulley with the 4 outer bolts, it sits on a (relatively) loose keyway on the crank end just for indexing. It's the pulley that really is friction fitted to the crank end through the diamond washer and held on with the giant bolt. It's a perfectly acceptable way of fitting it, so long as you fit it properly!
 

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£360 is the cost for a reconditioned head which includes camshaft, new hydraulic valves x 10, camshaft seals, new valves. Then £80 for the splined m12 bolts x 10 and head hasket from AW Engineering company on an exchange basis. So I will definitely and gladly go for that if this is all I need. But you are no doubt correct and I will need the pistons and a rebore as well. Did you repair your cheap Velle in the end? My van was valued by the insurance company at £12000 as its a pop top etc. Now its probably worth £2k!
No, I scrapped it.
Saved the auto box and had it re-conned by Mackies in Glasgow (quite a distance from mid-Norway!) and sold as many parts as I could.
In the end, I had a profit of around 3 grand (after taking into account the auto re-con and driving distance!).
Then, a "guy" came with a trailer and gave me £1500 for the scrap metal!
When you buy a vehicle in Norway, you pay around £3000 extra (on top of the 100% tax!), but if you scrap "officially" (with the original paperwork) you get that refunded. (y)
So this guy basically made double his payment to me, just for having a trailer big enough to take it.
Last time I was at VW dealer (some years ago!), a T5 Caravell/Multivan was around £80,000....if you bought the basic "van" (2 +1 seats), it was about 30k...they charge a HELL of a load of tax to get the rear seats and no dividing section. (If you cut that out/fit rear seats, you have to pay the extra tax!!!).....Road tax is also only about half for a "commercial" vehicle.
 

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Some interesting replies on here so far ?

One point rc_tech has made which I have been concerned over and that is +180 degree Angle torque of that crank pulley bolt. I've had my doubts that this could be achieved especially working at floor level but that Torque multiplier sounds interesting.
 
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