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T4 2.5 TDi 2003 SWB
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Discussion Starter #41
Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Hi deanj69,

That's the sort of thing that is required for a T4 ..... but nobody makes one !

The price reflects the amount of work that's gone into that. £ 100.00 just for the brackets.
Add to that the cost of the units ..... £ 300 'ish + the cost of the shroud.

And now you start to get an idea of just how much these things sell for !


Looking at that one, firstly, the units would be too far apart. The diameter of the headlamp holes are too big for Hella's
You'd probably have to buy what ever Jaguar use. And if they're too large, they won't fit the bulkhead.


I did look into this at the beginning of the project, I looked at so many vehicles as comparisons you wouldn't believe.

Easier to make your own, time consuming, but certainly cheaper.



Thanks dean



TURK
 

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T4 2.5 TDi 2003 SWB
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Discussion Starter #42
Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Hi guy's,

Have you done lots of reserch into the legality of making lights then?

Im presuming there are loads of rules that they must adhere to.
but people "make" lights for kit cars quite a bit (Which is what the Hella kits are for) so there must be a "How too" somewhere that will help.
To answer your question slimjim, yes, an awful lot of research and reading. You can find just about anything on the web.

The research begins purely by examining other vehicles though, walking round car parks, suspicious behavior I know ..... just don't get caught I: Headlamp manufacturers websites list technical details, and in some cases, the manufacturing process. DIY headlights and headlight modding is not a new thing, people do it all the time. No one had done T4 before though .... unfortunately :(

Daniel Stern Lighting was a great help to me. The guy' an authority on the subject. I also did a lot of testing and comparisons with various headlights I have here. I have a LUX meter that measures light intensity ( reflected light as well as direct light ).

It's not the recommended way of measuring just how bright your headlights are, but I'm doing it as a comparison. Standard VW headlights v Audi DRL type headlights v Hella quad headlights. My final findings should be interesting :D


The actual lamp design is very important as is the reflector and type of lamp used. As it's this that determines where the light is 'focused'.

That's the design flaw in the Audi DRL type headlight units ...... the light from the light bulb isn't 'focused', it's 'scattered' everywhere ! As an example, Take a look at the shape of the hight beam on a Audi DRL type headlamp ..... it's oblong.
5cm by 12cm ..... compare that to any mid range Merc or Beamer, and you'll see they're round, and the reflector is deep.

This is the main reason why I decided on the Hella 90mm Modular Series for my project. For their compactness, brightness, and build quality.
The casing is cast alloy, and the lens isn't plastic like some other manufactures, but strengthened glass.



If you want to give this a shot and make your own, I've got tons of data if you're interested.





TURK
 

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Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Super cool.

Im very interested. Not sure where I would start and it seems like you have got quite a way down the road as it is.

Totally agree with you on the Hella 90mm, where is the point in doing all this work if you don't get a GOOD light out of it at the end?
These 'Angel' and 'Hawk' eyes are supposed to look good (Personally, im not convinced) but I'd prefer decent lights to ones that "look" good anyway.

I guess the first step is getting hold of the standard light holders and working from there.
Will have a word with my guy and see if I can get hold of a pair. Just to have a look at. ;)
Out of interest... did you see how much they were from VW?
 

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Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

It's not the recommended way of measuring just how bright your headlights are, but I'm doing it as a comparison. Standard VW headlights v Audi DRL type headlights v Hella quad headlights. My final findings should be interesting :D
I reckon it'll be a real eye opener for some of those with the "cheapy" DRLs. I've seen some nice looking headlights on vans, but like you say, the reflectors on many have been thrown at the light rather than optimised

I work outside in the dark at festivals a lot and have developed a collection of torches, and you couldnt be more right. So much more goes into the lenses on expensive torches than the light/chip itself.

Great to think there'll be some DECENT headlights available soon that look great too.
 

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Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

If I'm not mistaken, there's already a company that make quad headlights for a long nose.
Not yet chap, I think Morette were looking into it but not heard anything :*

I happen to have a set of Projekt Zwo's if you need a template :) They use the same projectors as the BMW E30 T:
 

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T4 2.5 TDi 2003 SWB
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Discussion Starter #46
Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Hi slimjim,

Out of interest... did you see how much they were from VW?
No, never managed to find the actual part number :*

The very first picture of the thread, VW diagram found on the forum just has numbers on it. As it's a very poor copy, it looks like #2 but no part numbers were supplied.

When I buy something second hand, I usually try and get the original price from resellers. That way you know how much of a saving you are making. Tried Google as well, just came up with the entire unit including headlamp.


Totally agree with you on the Hella 90mm, where is the point in doing all this work if you don't get a GOOD light out of it at the end?
That's what I thought when I saw the Projekt Zwo'. I wanted to buy a set ( even checked out German eBay ), but they wanted so much money for them, most, if not all were water damaged. To the point where the reflector had started to peel !

Projekt Zwo used the same headlight units as the BMW E30, obviously they don't age too well.

To pay 3 to 400 quid for something just to copy, would of been a waste of money. I decided instead, to purchase the Hella units, and the rest on materials.


So, If anybody knows the part number, I'm still interested.





TURK
 

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T4 2.5 TDi 2003 SWB
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Discussion Starter #47
Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Hi t4Chippy,

I was writing my article as you posted yours about the E30's I:

In order to use the Projekt Zwo' as templates, I would have to use E30 light units or something similar.
The Hella units are more compact, and mounted closer together. So the frames would be a different size, it would also mean that the shrouds would be slightly different.


Thanks for the offer mate.



I've got a cunning plan :D



TURK
 

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Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Would you be able to do a set for long nose? As mentioned the project zwo are expencive and like rocking horse
 

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Discussion Starter #49
Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Hi all,


I happened to mention that a company already produced a quad headlight setup for the long nose, I was referring to these. >>



The van belongs to a forum member 'Vyper', you would have to ask him how effective they are.
Made by FK I believe. At least they've got round reflectors. Now that can't be too much hard work modding those !





TURK
 

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Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Hi all,


I happened to mention that a company already produced a quad headlight setup for the long nose, I was referring to these. >>



The van belongs to a forum member 'Vyper', you would have to ask him how effective they are.
Made by FK I believe. At least they've got round reflectors. Now that can't be too much hard work modding those !





TURK
Thanks. Must have missed that post. They doo look stunning and very oem thanks


And kudos to ypu for your effort and skills
 

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Discussion Starter #51
Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

No worries ozymaster :)

If you do manage to get a set of those. Don't forget to take pics of the install.
As I'd be very interested in seeing what the bulkhead design looks like on a long nose.

Maybe my design of the Hella quad headlights isn't too far off. It may be just a case of designing a different shroud.
I still think that the Hella light units would sit further back deeper in the shroud.



TURK
 

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T4 2.5 TDi 2003 SWB
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Discussion Starter #52
Re: Quad headlight design project ....... UPDATE

Hi all,

For those of you interested ...... and who have deep pockets :D

Hella have now updated their 90mm headlight range, some options have now been discontinued.
But luckily they have also added some new options to their range, namely LED headlights A:

Hella 90mm high beam unit >>




Hella 90mm high beam front view >>




Hella 90mm low beam unit >>




Hella 90mm low beam front view >>





All the above will sell for around £ 350.00 each :eek:

If that's too cheap for you may opt to go for the following option ......
Currently considered the best headlight on the market. Bi-LED headlight is Low beam that incorporates a High beam also. >>

http://www.rallylights.com/detail.aspx?ID=5138


I haven't a definate price as yet, but expect £ 500 + each unit :eek:




TURK
 

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Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Hi all,

I happened to mention that a company already produced a quad headlight setup for the long nose, I was referring to these. >>



The van belongs to a forum member 'Vyper', you would have to ask him how effective they are.
Made by FK I believe. At least they've got round reflectors. Now that can't be too much hard work modding those !

TURK
Are these available for right hand drive?......they look cool but I've only seen them LHD.
 

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Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Are these available for right hand drive?......they look cool but I've only seen them LHD.
Venom list theres as switchable. But i belive this just flaterns the been so you dont get the kick up on the left. :*
 

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Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Venom list theres as switchable. But i belive this just flaterns the been so you dont get the kick up on the left. :*
I've rung n asked them, they said they're LHD only. I also emailed a german seller of the same lights (who sell them much cheaper btw) and they said same thing "the lights are for left hand drive and not compatible for UK use".
 

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Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

I've rung n asked them, they said they're LHD only. I also emailed a german seller of the same lights (who sell them much cheaper btw) and they said same thing "the lights are for left hand drive and not compatible for UK use".
Was just gping on the website info T:

Tbh id like to have a look at the audi longe nose see if they can be improoved
 

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Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Was just gping on the website info T:
No worries, I was interested in them incase I could remove the reflectors and lenses and mod it to fit onto the shortnose mounting bracket. Changing light pattern is beyond me though.

Hence my intrigue and interest in what Mr Turk is doing... Maybe I'll learn a thing or two along his build too T:
 

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Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Hiya Turk, I can see you have made some great effort and I take my hat of to you, I can confirm that long nose angel eyes are LHD and are not switchable,I was pretty annoyed by this and I successfully converted a set to rhd using ford puma headlight parts,I was myself going to have a bash at making some short nose angel eyes but I'm struggling to get the glass smooth on the inside so at the moment it's on the back boiler, good luck with yours and I can't wait to see the end result
 

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T4 2.5 TDi 2003 SWB
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Discussion Starter #60
Re: Quad headlight design project grinds to a halt ..... again.

Hi all,

I would like to thank everyone for all those kind words of encouragement, and the support I'm getting from every body on the forum.
Particularly Camperwagen who has generously donated a pair of original VW headlight mounting frames, I should be receiving those any day now.

A big thank you also goes out to Jersey Steel Fabricators, who today gave me a sheet of 16swg 1050 marine grade aluminium for my templates.

To you guys who have the long nose version, sorry to hear that the lights are not what they claim to be ! If they are advertising that the light units are 'switchable' LHD / RHD, which they obviously are not ..... they aught to be reported to 'Trading Standards'.

I will try my utmost to design a set for the long nose version also.



t4Chippy You mentioned you had a set of Projekt Zwo ........ I wondered if I could be so bold in asking, could you take a picture of the indicator arrangement on them please. Did Projekt Zwo use their own type indicator, or was it possible to use the original VW one ?


With all this support and encouragement, where can I go wrong ? T:


I'll keep on updating this thread as I progress.

Thank you all.




TURK
 
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