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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hi to all.
My 2003, 2.5tdi(88 bhp) has become very smokey on start-up. The colour of the smoke is charcoaly/blue. The van has not used any oil or coolant and I checked this a number of times since last service (4000 miles ago); and the levels haven't change.

Van runs very rough on idle for first 10 to 20 seconds. The engine is juddering and vibrating a lot. I have had the van and connected on VAG COM and I have attached the pictures.

I have checked the van timing and it is extremely unstable, fluctuating in the range of 35 to 60 and fuel temp.152.

Just wondered if anybody has experienced the same or familiar problem with their van or an associate. Would really like some suggestions or solutions. Thanks guys in advance!






 

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Take the timing cover off the injection pump end and check on the belt wear and the tensioners. With the engine running you may be able to see the front tensioner bouncing. If so it's possibly belts and timing reset all round or injection pump/fuel pressure regulator in the pump on it's way out :(
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Take the timing cover off the injection pump end and check on the belt wear and the tensioners. With the engine running you may be able to see the front tensioner bouncing. If so it's possibly belts and timing reset all round or injection pump/fuel pressure regulator in the pump on it's way out :(
Thanks for respond Monza,i will check the tensioner tom..the pump option sounds bad and expensive:confused:please correct me if I'm wrong,and whats involved in sorting out pump?full refurb?
Thanks
Raff
 

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You still shouldn't be getting 460 on that reading though. Did you replace it with an ebay 30 quid one? Perhaps it's the wiring? By all means check the pump timing, but note a small amount of bounce is normal though (by small I mean a few mm)
 

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I agree with Mistergrumpy the reading from the MAF it isn't right I would try disconnecting it and seeing if it clears the running up at all.
I am just concerned with the fact your pump timing is bouncing and the advance been pegged up at 73% duty. Can you get into basic settings on block 0 and read the 2nd digit in, this is the timing advance, or tdi timing graph and select cloud this should give you an idea if the belts look ok.

Added to the fact I am now belt cautious after recent van related issues shall we say so anything like this I am looking at and commenting, just one to try in the list of problem solving T:
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
You still shouldn't be getting 460 on that reading though. Did you replace it with an ebay 30 quid one? Perhaps it's the wiring? By all means check the pump timing, but note a small amount of bounce is normal though (by small I mean a few mm)
I got Bosh one from tps,i will check wiring..thanks for adviceT:
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I agree with Mistergrumpy the reading from the MAF it isn't right I would try disconnecting it and seeing if it clears the running up at all.
I am just concerned with the fact your pump timing is bouncing and the advance been pegged up at 73% duty. Can you get into basic settings on block 0 and read the 2nd digit in, this is the timing advance, or tdi timing graph and select cloud this should give you an idea if the belts look ok.

Added to the fact I am now belt cautious after recent van related issues shall we say so anything like this I am looking at and commenting, just one to try in the list of problem solving T:
I will check MAF today,and also get the readings from vag..will keep updaiting.thanks budT:
 

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Is you EGR balnked or faulty? If the EGR valve is closed or blocked, the MAF will be high, as
no exhaust gas is recycled, and all the air taken in by the engine will be metered by the MAF.
Have you tried cycling the EGR in 'basic settings' and watched the MAF readings change as the valve opens and shuts?
 

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Erratic timing can be -

Fuel Temp sensor in pump
Needle motion sensor
Loose tensioner
Advance solenoid in pump

These are just a few things that spring to mind.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Is you EGR balnked or faulty? If the EGR valve is closed or blocked, the MAF will be high, as
no exhaust gas is recycled, and all the air taken in by the engine will be metered by the MAF.
Have you tried cycling the EGR in 'basic settings' and watched the MAF readings change as the valve opens and shuts?
yes mate EGR blanked..so dats y MAF readins r high:confused:is dat normal or I should remove the blankin plate.
Thanks raff
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Erratic timing can be -

Fuel Temp sensor in pump
Needle motion sensor
Loose tensioner
Advance solenoid in pump

These are just a few things that spring to mind.
Thanks Ron,but where to start..
-i will check belt tensioners 1st,but unfortunetly don't know much regarding to the pump and needle motion sensor:*is the any way to have them check with VAG-com?
or they need diesel specialist service to be look at.
Thank you very much Ron and looking forward to hear from you.
Ps.Are you doing any work on diesel pumps or just injectors?
 

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If you disconnect the needle lift sensor - (the cable going to the only injector that has a cable going to it), this will kick the ECU out of closed loop where the needle lift sensor is telling the ECU exactly when fuel is starting to be injected, and the ECU tweeks the timing to get it the same as the timing in it's maps.
When it's in open loop, the ECU retards the timing, and reduces injected quantity, but the timing will be stable if the needle lift sensor is causing the timing to be erratic.
If there is no change in the erratic timing, the needle lift sensor is probably OK.
Fuel temp can be read in measuring blocks, and should be a very steady reading, only showing slow rises and falls as the engine warms up or cools. If this reading jumps about, the sesor or wiring are faulty.
In basic settings, you should be able to cycle the advance solenoid from fully advanced to fully retarded - you will hear a big change in engine note if working, and the degrees of advance observed in VCDS.
 

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Hi Raff,

As bluzie said, also to test the sensor, it should be 85-115 ohms Stanadyne or 90-120 ohms Bosch, both hot and cold.
and open circuit between pins of connector and injector body.

And yes, we do work on pumps now too.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
If you disconnect the needle lift sensor - (the cable going to the only injector that has a cable going to it), this will kick the ECU out of closed loop where the needle lift sensor is telling the ECU exactly when fuel is starting to be injected, and the ECU tweeks the timing to get it the same as the timing in it's maps.
When it's in open loop, the ECU retards the timing, and reduces injected quantity, but the timing will be stable if the needle lift sensor is causing the timing to be erratic.
If there is no change in the erratic timing, the needle lift sensor is probably OK.
Fuel temp can be read in measuring blocks, and should be a very steady reading, only showing slow rises and falls as the engine warms up or cools. If this reading jumps about, the sesor or wiring are faulty.
In basic settings, you should be able to cycle the advance solenoid from fully advanced to fully retarded - you will hear a big change in engine note if working, and the degrees of advance observed in VCDS.
Hello and thank you for your response.


In regards to the needle lift sensor, I will check that asap (probably Sunday due to work).

The temperature sensor, I have tested this, in measuring blocks and the temperature reading seems to be fine on engine activity. The readings are not jerky.

Advance solenoid cycle..help..not sure about this..Unfortunately I am not an advanced user of VCDS, so any basic instructions would be helpful.
Thanks budT:
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Hi Raff,

As bluzie said, also to test the sensor, it should be 85-115 ohms Stanadyne or 90-120 ohms Bosch, both hot and cold.
and open circuit between pins of connector and injector body.

And yes, we do work on pumps now too.
Hi Ron,

Thanks, but I am confused, not because your instructions aren't clear, mainly because I am an amateur. Hot and cold engine?..Open circuit..but which pins of which connector?..What do I need and how is it done?..HELP an idiot!
I will be using multimeter first timeI::eek:I:
Regards
Raff
 
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